Tuesday 4 September 2012

Men! You're All Carrying An Offensive Weapon!*

Manraj Gahir, 21, was driving home after playing tennis with his friend Danish Ahmed, 22, when they were stopped by a police van in Morland Road, Addiscombe, at about 7.55pm last Tuesday.
Officers searched the car after telling the pair they were investigating a spate of burglaries in the area.
Fair enough. Nothing wrong with that.
Mr Gahir who is studying to become a quantity surveyor, said: "They were very aggressive, as soon as they opened the door they grabbed us out. They said it was because there was a torch next to us and we might use it as a weapon."
Yes, it could be used as such. Nothing wrong with that, though a sensible, not out-for-aggro officer will do well to keep that in mind rather than broadcast it to the (currently presumed innocent?) member of the public they just stopped...
"I had a belt and aftershave in the car door, the car is like my wardrobe I had about ten jackets in there too. They came over with the belt and said what is this used for? "I said 'Sir it's a clothing accessory,' but they said 'no that is not what we think it is intended for.
We are arresting you for possession of an offensive weapon.'
*speechless*
The friends were taken to South Norwood custody centre, where they were kept for six hours before being released without charge.
*still speechless*
Mr Gahir said the incident had left himself and Mr Ahmed, who is studying to become a doctor, with no confidence in the police.
Me too. If those officers aren't disciplined, and preferably removed from the force, we can expect more riots.

FFS! What were they thinking?
Superintendent Rob Atkin, Deputy Borough Commander for Croydon police said: "The Met has recently reviewed its stop and search policy and we are making changes to improve the way stop and search is carried out."
That word you use, 'improve'. I don't think it means what you think it means...

* No. Not that! God, what filthy minds you all have....

28 comments:

Bucko said...

I think a spare belt needs to be added to the kit in my boot if they hate them so much

Anonymous said...

Unlawful arrest, assault and detention are only three of the offences carried out if the story given is accurate. Not only the officers involved in the arrest but the Custody Sgt should be made to explain their actions. The reason given for the stop/check - investigating a series of burglaries in the area is also worth verifying. When, where and how many burglaries were there in the area? Were any people seen? What type of car, if any, was seen in the vicinity of these burglaries? Both of these young men appear to have a really good case against the Met. It will be interesting to see how this pans out and whether the Met will offer a more detailed explanation. I wouldn't have dreamed of doing something like this with just cause.
Penseivat

Anonymous said...

Sorry, the last sentence should have ended ".......without just cause."
Penseivat

Sobers said...

Reminds me of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BO8EpfyCG2Y

Anonymouslemming said...

I dunno, they look pretty guilty to me.

The picture of them by the car - are they now trying to assert that they weren't driving while brown ??

Anonymous said...

"...the last sentence should have ended .........without just cause."

Final answer? Sorry, must hurry you.

Anonymous said...

Oh, it's Pense plod. OK....just ten more attempts then.

Anonymous said...

Such stories are all too common-place these days and I'm going to hazard a guess that our newly recruited pleece ossifers JUST AREN"T TRAINED ANYMORE. Despite extensive diversity and human rights training, law and procedure simply are not taught properly and extensively, probably relying on distance learning packages and computer based training fitting in with family friendly 9-5- all inclusive, Muslim friendly non-residential training. Still, as my old mate Gadget often used to say when he ran a good blog - society gets the police it deserves, well the silent majority has got the police service the left liberal political elite have foisted on us. No more personal discretion and seemingly no common sense. At least in the 'old days' when you got fitted up you got fitted up properly, scrotes got a little tap here and there to ensure compliance and being dumped the other side of Shooters Hill for being a pain in the arse at night didn't leave the escorting officer liable to arrest for kidnap/abduction.
Not even old coppers have any time for the modern force but shake their heads silently and write impotent letters of sadness and rage in London Police Pensioner. The Jobs Fucked but does Deputy Borough Commander Atkin care? Does he fuck, more blah, blah blah. Evenin' all! Watch out young lady there's a pea-souper and no mistake - I hear the Ripper's abroad - let me escort you home and maybe cook will give me a slice of bread and tripping beggin' yer pardon.
I knew you lot would miss the 'old' coppers you used to hate so much - don't seem so bad these days do they?

jaded said...

Once again Julia you blog an anti-story where just one side is given.I'm sure if the men were treated so badly they will be suing and every fact will come out.
Don't believe everything you read.

PS where's Melvin,he should be eating this up...?

Tatty said...

* No. Not that! God, what filthy minds you all have....

I must have missed the bit the asterisk refers to...can you point it out so I can properly check if I have a filthy mind too ;)

Anonymous said...

I have seen belts used in fights. A few years back went to a large fight involving different gypsy groups. About half a dozen had their belts in the hands and swirling them round.

I'm pleased to report they had tight jeans on and their was no more visual unpleasantness than that!!!

Gangster types with baggy jeans had best avoid this style of fighting if they want a quick and dignified getaway.

I must point out, whilst no evidence in this case, there are a lot of websites out there showing ordinary items concealing weapons. Belt buckles included, along with pens, mobile phones as tasers etc.

I have always wondered, when i have arrested youths for carrying baseball bats under their drivers seat why they never have a baseball with them? Still waiting for the smart thug to put a ball under his seat to claim he is a sport lover!

Anonymous said...

Anon at 14.15 @ 14.17 - Back to the insults are you? Argument lost!
Penseivat

Pavlov's Cat said...

They said it was because there was a torch next to us and we might use it as a weapon."

Depends on the torch , it maybe an urban legend , but I was told the 4-6 D Cell Maglites were specifically developed for US Law enforcement when they stopped them using Night-Sticks. (Which is why in police procedurals on tv they are used cocked over the shoulder so the barrel can be brought down quickly to thump someone, purely in self defence)

Which why I have a 4D Cell one in the car and a 5D cell one just by the bedroom door purely in case of eeeeerrr power cuts

Maglite product range

RAB said...

Yes always worth checking if there were any burglaries in the area Penseivat, and Plod have helpfully provided us with a website to do just that...

http://www.police.uk/

Anything can be used as an offensive weapon if the person weilding it knows how, even a newspaper. My wife has lost three sets of nailcippers to airport security so far, yet I sail through with a pocket full of pencils and pens. And I can kill you a damn sight quicker with those than effing nailclippers!

Plod were clutching at straws here.

Woman on a Raft said...

No idea if this is reliable in the comments, or if it conflates other events, or if it is misinformation in order to neutralize the story.

You have to set your own worth on a whisper according to the context.

The two men were arrested on suspicion of possession of an offensive weapon (other than a knife), at approximately 19:55hrs on Tuesday 14 August after they were stopped in a vehicle by officers from the MET Police Territorial Support Group on patrol in Gordon Crescent, SE25. The officers searched the vehicle and four items were seized including a belt, metal spike, torch and baseball bat.

It seems to me that only the baseball bat needs explaining; 'a metal spike' could be anything but a baseball bat is only really useful for two things.

Anonymous said...

RAB, if the fcts given by the youths are correct then I would suggest the Police were clutching at straws.
However, if, as WOAR mentions, there was a baseball bat and a metal spike in the car then perhaps they weren't as innocent as they claim? No mention of a baseball, so perhaps they were going to throw the spike up in the air and hit that? Or perhaps try and catch it in the loop of a belt, using the torch to see when it became dark? Until the full story comes out, apart from the youths and the Police officers, no one knows what really happened. So before anyone starts throwing accusations around, including me, let's just wait and see what happens, shall we? If there is no civil case for damages, then I would suggest the youths have more to hide than they claim. If the Police were at fault, I will be one of the first to criticise them. On the other hand............! Are you reading this, Noggy?
Penseivat

Anonymous said...

Crikey, if I could run all my cases at court with just one parties uncontested version of events, then it might even persuade some of the magistrates.
Luckily you only have to convince "outraged of Bognor Regis" - so well done with that.

Noggin the Nog said...

Pense,

You'll be pleased to know that I think the driver's story sounds well iffy to me. Not unsusal for curry munchers to leave out pertinent facts that may incriminate them.

The only thing I find strange is that they were not charged.

Anonymous said...

As has been previously mentioned, belts are a common weapon nowadays. I worked in a neighbouring borough to Croydon and we'd see gang fights (mainly East Europeans) in the High Street and when it all kicked off first thing they went for was to take their belts off.

Anonymous said...

Noggy,
why the racist comment? I know of quite a few 'curry munchers' who make better citizens than 'bacon butty scoffers'. Take the race element out of it and you are left with (possibly) some lads up to no good or some coppers exceeding their powers. Let's allow the facts to come out, eh? Jaded gives some good advice.
Penseive

JuliaM said...

"I think a spare belt needs to be added to the kit in my boot if they hate them so much"

:D

" It will be interesting to see how this pans out and whether the Met will offer a more detailed explanation."

I think it'll depend on if they make a formal complaint. Then we might find out if the anonymous commenter in the news article is just blowing ink.

"Reminds me of this"

Yes!!

" Despite extensive diversity and human rights training, law and procedure simply are not taught properly and extensively, probably relying on distance learning packages and computer based training fitting in with family friendly 9-5- all inclusive, Muslim friendly non-residential training."

It's quite amazing, isn't it? They cannot blame the old 'canteen culture' either, since they've got rid of most canteens!

JuliaM said...

"I knew you lot would miss the 'old' coppers you used to hate so much - don't seem so bad these days do they?"

A couple of series each of 'Life On Mars' and 'Ashes To Ashes' agrees.

"Once again Julia you blog an anti-story where just one side is given."

The police wiould have been given the opportunity to comment. It's neither my fault, not that of the newspaper, if they chose to whisk out some meaningless boilerplate instead.

By the way, are you 'jaded48' who was commenting on CiF's Azell Rodney whitewash yesterday?

"I have always wondered, when i have arrested youths for carrying baseball bats under their drivers seat why they never have a baseball with them? "

Or swap it for a cricket bat!

"..but I was told the 4-6 D Cell Maglites were specifically developed for US Law enforcement when they stopped them using Night-Sticks."

Interesting! I was only last night tutting at 'CSI' with their teeny tiny torches, trying to peer into a mineshaft. "Why don't they have bigger ones?" I thought...

JuliaM said...

"Anything can be used as an offensive weapon if the person weilding it knows how, even a newspaper. "

Well, quite! Even my late father - and then myself - drove around with one, albeit inadvertently. Lucky neither of us looked like burglars, eh?

"No idea if this is reliable in the comments, or if it conflates other events, or if it is misinformation in order to neutralize the story. "

Interesting! I know where I'd place my bet.

"...t and when it all kicked off first thing they went for was to take their belts off."

And their trousers never fell down? ;)

"Take the race element out of it..."

But as the mention of the 'Constable Savage' clip points out, we really can't. Can we?

Noggin the Nog said...

Pense,

How about you leave your pre conditioning out of it, and stop using meaningless words?

WPC Jilted said...


'By the way, are you 'jaded48' who was commenting on CiF's Azell Rodney whitewash yesterday?'

"Arrested,out in a few years to continue being a scumbag,or arrested, go to court and get off at great expense?

You have to realise the writer of this report assumes everyone is nice,the police are all nasty and no-one is ever guilty (except the nasty police of course)Let's ask Helen if she would be happy if her daughter bought this man home as her new boyfriend."

coarse it were jaded an she speeks for us cos off her gud inglsih.

jaded said...

Yes I am Jaded48 on CIF as Jaded is already taken.
I apologise for not being as educated as you are Melvin.I think once on here I got my "there's" mixed up and he leapt on it like a hungry wolf to prove that all police are stupid.
Stupid or not MTG,i'm entitled to my opinion and I know a lot more about policing than you ever will.

Lynne said...

Perhaps it was the name wot did it. Danish Ahmad comes across much in the same way as Fingers Molloy and Knuckles Armstrong does.

James Higham said...

Not sure my weapon is quite as offensive these days.